If you look through McD and other vegan forums, you may notice that thyroid dysfunction is one of the most common complaint! Please note that the hypo and hyper-thyroidism is by itself a heart disease risk factor, it adds up and compounds the risk factors of metabolic syndrome or pre-diabetes.
Cabbage family of plant (cabbage, brussels, cauliflower, broccoli etc) are the known goitrogens (= thyroid disruptors). Beans family of plants are another goitrogens, especially soy.
Once you eliminate those out of your diet then what is left? Potatoes and rice only?
I am sorry to say, but none of what you and other vegans do makes any sense to me!
Re: This study says the opposite.That meat did not come off all that bad when compared to carbs has to mean junk carbs and that means sugar. So,in this study sugar came out worse than fat and meat.
You are making assumption here that the Austrian vegetarian were overeating sugar or that their diet were in same way imperfect compared with McDougall and other diet promoters'. This is a pure speculation that is seems to be based on your opinion alone rather than the facts. You have no factual base whatsoever to assume that it is so. If I were to apply your logic I may just as well postulate that it is McDougall's dieters that may deviate from the "pure" vegetarianism, why not? There is no evidence whatsoever one way or the other! At least the Austrians did the study, while McDougall didn't!
I could just as easily speculate that the only reason McDougall diet may be regarded as "healthy" by some is because there has been no studies comparing those and the meat eaters, matched age-for-age and with many other known risk factors matched as well.
In fact I am very surprised that Dr. McDougall hasn't yet given up his vegetarianism, after so many decades of progressively more and more damning scientific evidence, both statistical and biochemical, showing up the harmful effect of the fat and meat defficient high carb diets on human body, beyond reasonable doubt!
No bubonic plague, I am just not that interested debating dieters and diet promoters any more. I did some service a few years ago by informing people who didn't mind talking to me, that there are alternatives to what they hear in the media. Including an alternative to what you EG were trying to advocate. 8-
Now it is basically all widely widely know, and my job here is basically done as far as trashing nutritional beliefs is concerned (but perhaps not yet finished about some other beliefs... )
Best regards, Stan (Heretic)
There is a new revolution going on in physics, see some recent posts on my stan-heretic blog.View Thread
Look at table 1. Meat and fruit consumption was similar in the cancer group and in the control group but alcohol and cigarettes were twice the amount than the control group, and 70-90% cases were men! (Except breast cancer)
Since the difference in fruit and veg that they focused upon, was so small, while the other factors that they tried to subtract out of the analysis, are so large, chances are the results are just some residual noise rather than the real effect.
This paper is irrelevant because both diets under study were high carb diets and the amount of fat added was only 25g. They just studied the effect of adding fat to a high carbohydrate high insulinemic diets. Adding fat if you already consume high amount of carbs is bad for you. Duh!
We can deal with a fairly large amount of fructose and other sugars if we are young and healthy. If not then we are better off without it altogether. Fructose is not essential, neither is sugar or starch. as for that sorry 811 person, we are dealing with an obsession and self-destructive fanaticism. You cannot help her just like you cannot help other people fanatically obsessed or "possessed" by all sorts of fanatical beliefs (and diet is probably the least of the problem here...). People like that are destructive towards themselves and may even pose a threat to others.
IMHO, the best way of dealing with fanatical ideas (or any "meme" ideas, for that matter...) is to challenge them openly BEFORE they become too entrenched in the minds and destroy the lives of too many people.
Everything is wrong with 811 diet! Too much fructose, too much carbohydrates, too little protein and usually of the wrong aminoacid types unless you do a hell of a job of food combining.
Plant based nutrition is second best for humans and can lead to problems for various reasons, one of them is that they produce high oxidative stress, not only due to high carbohydrate and especially high fructose contents, but also because of various phytotoxins, especially in green leafy parts.
Last but not least is the suboptimal vitamin contents, with lack of D3 and K2 being probably the most problematic, and also often skewed microelements. For example some plants such as beans tend to concentrate elements such as aluminum and manganese (especially soy!), and are generally too imbalanced for humans due to the fact that plants stand too far from from us on the evolution thus are too dissimilar (fungi are an even more extreme example). Plant based nutrition requires a special digestive tract adaptation seen in herbivorous animals. Omnivorious animals are not as well equipped and thus require mixed and balanced food. HereticView Thread